4 Deputy Public Prosecutors against a 61-year-old Singaporean Ivan Koh Yew Beng

The 4 Deputy Public Prosecutors involved are:
1. Senior Director/Senior State Counsel/DPP Francis NG Yong Kiat
2. Deputy Senior State Counsel/DPP John LU Zhuoren
3. State Counsel/DPP Amanda CHONG Wei-Zhen
4. State Counsel/DPP Jane LIM Ern Hui

The following was the cross-examination that happened in Singapore’s state court against 61-year-old Singaporean Ivan Koh Yew Beng who did not have any legal representation or legal aid.

Deputy Senior State Counsel DPP John LU Zhuoren: Do you know that there is such a place as Speakers' Corner?
61-year-old Singaporean Ivan Koh Yew Beng: Yes.

Deputy Senior State Counsel DPP John LU Zhuoren: And you know the purpose of Speakers' Corner i.e. you can go there to protest?
61-year-old Singaporean Ivan Koh Yew Beng: The place is for the freedom of speech and expressions.

Deputy Senior State Counsel DPP John LU Zhuoren: So let's go straight to the 27th of September 2014. Now, you went there that day that afternoon, is that correct? 1.00-plus, 2.00pm? Some time --- somewhere there?
61-year-old Singaporean Ivan Koh Yew Beng: 1.00 a little bit after that.

Deputy Senior State Counsel DPP John LU Zhuoren: And when you arrived at Hong Lim Park at --- after 1 o'clock, the YMCA event had not started yet, is that correct?
61-year-old Singaporean Ivan Koh Yew Beng: Not started yet.

Deputy Senior State Counsel DPP John LU Zhuoren: And you came to know of the event, this CPF event, from Facebook, is that correct?
61-year-old Singaporean Ivan Koh Yew Beng: Yes.

Deputy Senior State Counsel DPP John LU Zhuoren: So for the 27th September event, could you tell us which Facebook page did you go to find out information about the CPF event?
61-year-old Singaporean Ivan Koh Yew Beng: There's some posting I saw that.

Deputy Senior State Counsel DPP John LU Zhuoren: Did they mention that some of the prominent speaker would be Ms Han?
61-year-old Singaporean Ivan Koh Yew Beng: No, I don’t think so.

Deputy Senior State Counsel DPP John LU Zhuoren: You brought along your own placards?
61-year-old Singaporean Ivan Koh Yew Beng: Yes.

Deputy Senior State Counsel DPP John LU Zhuoren: And you --- now, we have now heard that the --- from the NParks officer that there was actually no approval to hold a demonstration at Hong Lim Park on the 27th of September 2014. You were not aware of this, were you?
61-year-old Singaporean Ivan Koh Yew Beng: I'm not aware.

Deputy Senior State Counsel DPP John LU Zhuoren: You also did not check whether there was approval?
61-year-old Singaporean Ivan Koh Yew Beng: I did not check.

Deputy Senior State Counsel DPP John LU Zhuoren: Before the 27th of September itself, you knew about the YMCA event?
61-year-old Singaporean Ivan Koh Yew Beng: I didn't know about it.

Deputy Senior State Counsel DPP John LU Zhuoren: So it was only when you arrived at the park that day that you realised that there was another event ongoing?
61-year-old Singaporean Ivan Koh Yew Beng: Yes.

Deputy Senior State Counsel DPP John LU Zhuoren: So your idea was to, in the middle of the speeches, just walk around with your placards?
61-year-old Singaporean Ivan Koh Yew Beng: Yes.

Deputy Senior State Counsel DPP John LU Zhuoren: And if there were any kind of chance or any part of the speech that you agreed with, would you shout your approval?
61-year-old Singaporean Ivan Koh Yew Beng: Yes.

Deputy Senior State Counsel DPP John LU Zhuoren: You highlighted that you just wave your placard, is that correct?
61-year-old Singaporean Ivan Koh Yew Beng: Yes.

Deputy Senior State Counsel DPP John LU Zhuoren: Right. So you see, Mr Koh, the videos that you showed us, there is a problem with them, would you agree?
61-year-old Singaporean Ivan Koh Yew Beng: Problem?

Deputy Senior State Counsel DPP John LU Zhuoren: There's a problem with the videos you showed them because the video you showed us earlier this morning only showed what happened at the mound area, isn't that right? My point is the videos you took the Court through this morning, they don't tell the full story of what you did that day, isn't that right, Mr Koh?
61-year-old Singaporean Ivan Koh Yew Beng: I'm sure the police also have record some videos about that. Many other people have then why you choose this Mr Lim?

Deputy Senior State Counsel DPP John LU Zhuoren: Mr Teo is actually almost in front of you, isn't that correct, Mr Koh? And I think this is the moment which you alluded to this morning that he shook your hand and --- and he offered you tissue paper, that's correct?
61-year-old Singaporean Ivan Koh Yew Beng: Is anything wrong?

Deputy Senior State Counsel DPP John LU Zhuoren: No, no, there's nothing wrong with that. So you were having an in --- a moment of interaction with Mr Teo?
61-year-old Singaporean Ivan Koh Yew Beng: He seem to be happy. See all the way he's laughing, smiling, right?

Deputy Senior State Counsel DPP John LU Zhuoren: So you were actually fully committed to the protest, weren't you, Mr Koh?
61-year-old Singaporean Ivan Koh Yew Beng: I say I'm not fully committed means I trying to say that all the time I was not with the speaker at the mound there, right, I was somewhere else, you see. So if you going to say it's fully committed mean all the while I'll be sticking to the speaker, all this and that. You see, I go there and support only.

Deputy Senior State Counsel DPP John LU Zhuoren: You were a key participant in the CPF protestors --- in the CPF protest on the 27th of September 2014, isn't that correct?
61-year-old Singaporean Ivan Koh Yew Beng: What make you think that I am a key participant in the CPF protest? Other than that people are taking placard and shouting slogan louder than me. I only shouted one slogan.

Deputy Senior State Counsel DPP John LU Zhuoren: The fact is the other people may have done other things but my point is you joined in with them, isn't that correct?
61-year-old Singaporean Ivan Koh Yew Beng: I don't know who are they.

Deputy Senior State Counsel DPP John LU Zhuoren: Alright. Now, Mr Koh, you could have shown support in many ways, right. You could have shown support for the event in many ways. Right. You could have just stood at one side, you could have just clap. Isn't that correct?
61-year-old Singaporean Ivan Koh Yew Beng: You can say that?

Deputy Senior State Counsel DPP John LU Zhuoren: Correct, yes. So --- but, I mean, when it comes to a protest, you agree with me that if there are more protesters, it has more of an effect, isn't it?
61-year-old Singaporean Ivan Koh Yew Beng: Not really, it's because I don't know the rest of the people then how they going to react, you see. I cannot just tell you, say, my speculations.

Deputy Senior State Counsel DPP John LU Zhuoren: But you would agree with me that if you were to go there and do a one-person protest, it will not be as powerful as the many person protest that happened that day that's correct? And on that day itself, as you joined in the CPF protestors, would you agree with me that they were trying to bring their protest message to Mr Teo Ser Luck? Would you agree with me?
61-year-old Singaporean Ivan Koh Yew Beng: Because Teo Ser Luck was the minister of this --- what is that? MOM, right?

Deputy Senior State Counsel DPP John LU Zhuoren: He's a minister, we can leave it at that, yah?
61-year-old Singaporean Ivan Koh Yew Beng: Okay, he's in charge of this. So most of participant there okay, we don't put Teo Ser Luck there, okay, we put another minister there. I don't think this people want to confront, go near him to ask back for money, right?

Deputy Senior State Counsel DPP John LU Zhuoren: Yes… No… But…
61-year-old Singaporean Ivan Koh Yew Beng: Why don't they put other minister like maybe put this --- who, Denise Phua or what or maybe Chan Chun Sing?

Deputy Senior State Counsel DPP John LU Zhuoren: Yes... No… But… my point is that it was very clear to you that the CPF protestors were trying to send a message to Mr Teo Ser Luck?
61-year-old Singaporean Ivan Koh Yew Beng: Owe money pay money.

Deputy Senior State Counsel DPP John LU Zhuoren: And so, the CPF protestors, in order to get to Mr Teo to send their message, they needed to, in a sense, cut through the YMCA event, isn't that correct?
61-year-old Singaporean Ivan Koh Yew Beng: Cut through in which way?

Deputy Senior State Counsel DPP John LU Zhuoren: They --- physically they had to go through the tentages, isn't that correct?
61-year-old Singaporean Ivan Koh Yew Beng: As what Mr Chia had said in the witness box said he had put some potted plant to be a barricade and when I ask Samantha Seah, she said no, there is no barricade. So this in this case, the YMCA is big, such a big organisation, I think they can afford some barricade there, right?

Deputy Senior State Counsel DPP John LU Zhuoren: We would never truly know what could have been done or would have been done but from has happened, what did happen on that day, you would agree with me that it's quite clear that the CPF protesters were quite ready to cut through the vicinity of the YMCA event to get to Mr Teo, isn't that correct?
61-year-old Singaporean Ivan Koh Yew Beng: Cannot say that you know because I disagree on that because the Speaker Comer, they allowed everybody to move around freely, right. If there's regulation said, "Okay, you cannot move around freely", so you have to put barricade or whatever.

Deputy Senior State Counsel DPP John LU Zhuoren: So?
61-year-old Singaporean Ivan Koh Yew Beng: So they did not do their own duties on that.

Deputy Senior State Counsel DPP John LU Zhuoren: Okay. So?
61-year-old Singaporean Ivan Koh Yew Beng: So what they are trying to claim we intruded them?

Deputy Senior State Counsel DPP John LU Zhuoren: Protestors who were behind them along the path --- paved walkway into the sheltered area --- and lined up, in a sense, in front of the Telok Ayer stage and it was in that moment that they interacted with Mr Teo, isn't that correct?
61-year-old Singaporean Ivan Koh Yew Beng: They did not line up. Line up means, okay, everybody stand straight, the minister is coming.

Deputy Senior State Counsel DPP John LU Zhuoren: Fair enough. And we also have heard evidence from the YMCA employees that because of the protestors' actions, whom you were a part of, the --- Mr Teo, the guest of honour, actually had to leave early. Isn't that---you remember this evidence?
61-year-old Singaporean Ivan Koh Yew Beng: This is what they say. The can say whatever they like, you see.

Deputy Senior State Counsel DPP John LU Zhuoren: So you would agree with me that the actions of the CPF protestors that day directly disrupted the YMCA event, isn't that correct?
61-year-old Singaporean Ivan Koh Yew Beng: If you want me to express this, I can state in full. First thing, you see, as what I heard that the YMCA emcee blast the speaker at the protestor, "We love CPF." This is what I heard. So he from the start, he is making a challenge to the CPF protestor. And he blast the speaker more louder. This is what they claim. Hong Lim Park is designated area, everybody have the freedom to express their expression, this and that.

Deputy Senior State Counsel DPP John LU Zhuoren: The common intention to disrupt the YMCA event, the purpose behind it was to bring your protest message to the guest of honour, Mr Teo Ser Luck, isn't that correct?
61-year-old Singaporean Ivan Koh Yew Beng: I don't think common intention. We all just follow the flow of the protest. Common intention means you are trying to say we gang up, right. I don't agree with that you used the word "common intention".

Deputy Senior State Counsel DPP John LU Zhuoren: Right. There were shout --- they were --- you were all shouting loudly, isn't that correct?
61-year-old Singaporean Ivan Koh Yew Beng: Because the regulation did not say you cannot shout, take placard or whatever in the designated area right?

Deputy Senior State Counsel DPP John LU Zhuoren: Right. You --- all of you were chanting slogans, isn't that correct?
61-year-old Singaporean Ivan Koh Yew Beng: YMCA also shouting.

Deputy Senior State Counsel DPP John LU Zhuoren: Alright.
61-year-old Singaporean Ivan Koh Yew Beng: They are blasting their speaker also.

Deputy Senior State Counsel DPP John LU Zhuoren: Yes.
61-year-old Singaporean Ivan Koh Yew Beng: So they should be public nuisance.